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Old 11-30-2009, 05:43 PM   #31
Marcus
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

NBC and CBS Researching Climategate; Still No Coverage
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Old 11-30-2009, 10:43 PM   #32
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.


Major MSM cover up



Site Search Term Results

CNN site:www.cnn.com climategate 0
BBC site:www.bbc.com climategate 0
NY Times site:www.nytimes.com climategate 5 (in comments mostly)
MSNBC site:www.MSNBC.com climategate 0
CBS (See BS) site:www.cbs.com climategate 0
ABC News site:www.abcnews.com climategate 0
Wall St. Journal site:www.WSJ.com climategate 1
Financial Times site:www.FT.com climategate 8 (comment/Opinion)
NY Post site:www.NYPost.com climategate 36
Sky News (UK) site:news.sky.com climategate 68
Huffington Post site:www.huffingtonpost.com climategate 6,530
Fox News site:www.foxnews.com climategate 855
Free Republic site:www.freerepublic.com climategate 13,400
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Old 11-30-2009, 11:01 PM   #33
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

Not being reported much but I heard stuff about it all weekend and then again today. Hopefully the word will get out enough. I know it did in the hardcore-right circle.
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Old 11-30-2009, 11:51 PM   #34
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

Carbon dioxide levels are increasing from human input, glaciers are melting, polar ice coverage is reducing rapidly and apparently the pH of the oceans are being impacted. We know that the earth has gone through very extreme cyclic variations in temperature and climate based on geologic history and these variations have caused variations in sea level of at least a 100 feet not all that long ago. Do some Emails from 1996 change these facts?

I can go for some of the conspiracy stuff. I don't believe half of the official WTC/9-11 story the government has put out. I'm beginning to believe that it is probably likely that space aliens (or time travelers) have visited earth; the French have recently released a lot of documents if you haven't heard. But I just don't understand the scientific basis for a dis-belief of the global warming process.
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:33 AM   #35
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

I just wish someone would be able to explain to me why glaciers are receding? If they aren't melting then what is the cause of it?
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:27 AM   #36
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

I am not the best person to take up this side but here goes.

First, people would have you believe that temperatures are rising and global ice is melting. The truth is that all studies that found these phenomena were ALL funded by some Green cause. There are MANY studies that refute this but no one would publish the information. Don't underestimate the power of funding and the amount that plays into recorded results. This has been proven in multiple studies from pharma to ape watching. Here is a link, but do a Google search:
http://www.outsourcing-pharma.com/Cl...s-new-research
Glaciers are also expanding and the polar ice density reached its record (high) this year (maybe last year, I forget).

Secondly, the data that you are most likely referring to is actually the data in question. The emails confirm that the data has been cooked. This is the most prolific data out there (it is used the most), and the longest reaching (it goes back further); therefore it is really hard to say things like "the global temperature is rising" or "the sea levels are rising". We simply do NOT have the data.

Next, when asked for the raw data over a couple decades, people were turned down over and over. Eventually the researchers in question said that the raw data had been trashed (in 1986?). Turns out that the data existed until very recently and has now come up missing again.

Most people can agree that the earth MAY be going through a cyclic change. Most people can also agree that humans have not helped the environment. Still the earth DOES go through EXTREME changes without the help of humans. We have done alot of harm to the planet and we should be more responsible about all of the issues surrounding that. That doesn't mean that we are causing "global climate change".

The (C02) numbers are really sketchy too (admittedly I don't know the variances). The variances, since we have been recording CO2 levels, are FAR less than a PERCENT. Like in the HUNDREDTHS of a percent. Hopefully someone can put those up. Anyways with numbers like that, do you really think that we can drastically change our climate or STOP the "global climate change" by tweaking a number by another hundredth of a percent? Maybe but my bet is NO.

Lastly the PH, Water Temps, and Water Level #'s, in any other situation, would never be the basis for even SPECULATION. They haven't been taken for a long enough period to show a trend, they have never been taken ACCURATELY, and they are of the SMALLEST variance over extremely long periods of time. Human error is a far more likely cause, or maybe Human persuasion.

Does any of this remind you of another situation. Maybe more decisions made by people with super SKETCHY science? Like fish closures? Something to think about.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:53 AM   #37
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spearstudtx View Post
I am not the best person to take up this side but here goes.

First, people would have you believe that temperatures are rising and global ice is melting. The truth is that all studies that found these phenomena were ALL funded by some Green cause. There are MANY studies that refute this but no one would publish the information. Don't underestimate the power of funding and the amount that plays into recorded results. This has been proven in multiple studies from pharma to ape watching. Here is a link, but do a Google search:
http://www.outsourcing-pharma.com/Cl...s-new-research
Glaciers are also expanding and the polar ice density reached its record (high) this year (maybe last year, I forget).

Secondly, the data that you are most likely referring to is actually the data in question. The emails confirm that the data has been cooked. This is the most prolific data out there (it is used the most), and the longest reaching (it goes back further); therefore it is really hard to say things like "the global temperature is rising" or "the sea levels are rising". We simply do NOT have the data.

Next, when asked for the raw data over a couple decades, people were turned down over and over. Eventually the researchers in question said that the raw data had been trashed (in 1986?). Turns out that the data existed until very recently and has now come up missing again.

Most people can agree that the earth MAY be going through a cyclic change. Most people can also agree that humans have not helped the environment. Still the earth DOES go through EXTREME changes without the help of humans. We have done alot of harm to the planet and we should be more responsible about all of the issues surrounding that. That doesn't mean that we are causing "global climate change".

The (C02) numbers are really sketchy too (admittedly I don't know the variances). The variances, since we have been recording CO2 levels, are FAR less than a PERCENT. Like in the HUNDREDTHS of a percent. Hopefully someone can put those up. Anyways with numbers like that, do you really think that we can drastically change our climate or STOP the "global climate change" by tweaking a number by another hundredth of a percent? Maybe but my bet is NO.

Lastly the PH, Water Temps, and Water Level #'s, in any other situation, would never be the basis for even SPECULATION. They haven't been taken for a long enough period to show a trend, they have never been taken ACCURATELY, and they are of the SMALLEST variance over extremely long periods of time. Human error is a far more likely cause, or maybe Human persuasion.

Does any of this remind you of another situation. Maybe more decisions made by people with super SKETCHY science? Like fish closures? Something to think about.
Wow, glaciers are NOT receeding over the last 30 years.

Sea level is NOT rising

the changes in pH in the Ocean are artifacts of bad data collection.

you claim the changes in atmospheric CO2 are less than one percent so i am to take your word that it doesn't matter because anything that small must be insignificant.

Apparently ALL SCIENCE is bad because some local, very poorly funded fish biologists that work for the government don't have good data and are making questionable predictions.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:58 AM   #38
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

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Wow, glaciers are NOT receeding over the last 30 years.
I think you mean well but you are clearly not interested in hearing the other side. To that end you piss me off. I respect what you are saying but you didn't read with an open mind at all. The global warming science IS bad. In a direct address to your above quote:

http://www.iceagenow.com/Growing_Glaciers.htm

Please look at this site. There is a significant amount of scientific data on there. All of it points to growing glaciers. You may not believe everything I am telling you but you should take it into account. There is another side to this story, aside from what Al Gore would have you believe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfjf View Post
Sea level is NOT rising

the changes in pH in the Ocean are artifacts of bad data collection.

you claim the changes in atmospheric CO2 are less than one percent so i am to take your word that it doesn't matter because anything that small must be insignificant.
http://bartgordon.net/2008/10/03/glo...yths-debunked/

There is a significant amount of evidence for both sides. Until now the other side has been squashed. Hopefully we will now get to hear both sides.
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Old 12-01-2009, 05:05 PM   #39
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

I sent my congressmen an email requesting a full investigation into this issue prior to any new legislation being signed. Congress.org
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― Frederic Bastiat, The Law
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:01 PM   #40
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

I was being a bit sarcastic, most of the worlds glaciers are receding. By the way there is significant amounts of evidence that the Holocaust didn't happen, just because people create evidence doesn't make it true.
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:05 PM   #41
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

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Quote all the papers on glaciers you want, I have seen first hand how much they are receding in Switzerland. I have lived there in the 60's and have photos of myself on glaciers where there are now no glaciers. Maybe they just misplaced them, you know how nutty those crazy Swiss are.
Unfortunately, a single glacier receding doesn't count as "global climate change". There is in fact a significant amount of data showing how glaciers are actually GROWING. Some, no doubt are receding but if some are growing, what then? I am not saying either side is right but I sure would like to know all of the data. I would also really appreciate people not fudging it for their cause (whatever that might be).
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:07 PM   #42
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

sorry I changed my post above but I still stand on that. Please direct me to any peer reviewed scientific studies on glacial growth worldwide and I may be convinced.
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:24 PM   #43
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

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sorry I changed my post above but I still stand on that. Please direct me to any peer reviewed scientific studies on glacial growth worldwide and I may be convinced.
That is actually a big part of the issue involved with Climategate (from my understanding). If you read about it, dissenting views were refused the right to be published. If we can't read about both sides of the issue how could we possibly make an informed decision?

Honestly it is probably a moot point until there is an investigation. The rest seems to be speculation which is what I am fighting against.
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:33 PM   #44
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

The government, contrary to popular belief, doesn't control the dissemination of scientific information. The last administration held views that were wildly at odds with climate change so why wasn't any of this information released then?
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Old 12-01-2009, 06:39 PM   #45
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Re: Global Warm...uh...er...Climate Change, our gov't, and the lies.

Climategate has nothing to do with our gov't. It has to do with the doctoring of raw data and people in power on the Green side controlling the dissemination of information. Climategate is mostly centered around the University of East Anglia's Climatic Research Unit. Their data is used to make decisions regarding policy in the UN and by our gov't though.

Regarding the rest of your post, you need to read up on the Climategate deal if you want to discuss it. I don't want to have to explain every aspect of it for you. If you did read it, you need to reread it because the questions you pose are directly answered in some of the links posted here and can be directly answered with a simple Google search.
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