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Old 08-26-2019, 11:33 AM   #1
A-Train
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What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Hello, just asking around out there. I was looking around at new custom guns and came across the Impaler spearguns that Jason Tiller was making out of florida and i really liked the design and craftmanship i saw in his work but it seems hes not making guns for public anymore. Anyone know a story behind this?
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Old 08-26-2019, 03:52 PM   #2
popgun pete
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

The same question was asked here: http://www.spearboard.com/showthread...aler+spearguns

Maybe follow up on some of the info there.
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Old 08-26-2019, 04:58 PM   #3
A-Train
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Yep seems nobody knows. The info is out there just gotta find it lol
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Old 08-26-2019, 09:29 PM   #4
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Herein lies your answer:

http://spearboard.com/showthread.php?t=191514
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Old 08-26-2019, 10:10 PM   #5
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

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Originally Posted by AEgir View Post
That is in May 2017, he is still posting in September of that year. "One swallow doth not a Summer make".
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Old 08-27-2019, 10:20 AM   #6
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Just read that whole thread. Man what a nightmare. I've been building guns for a few years now, mostly just for friends and local divers, and have been looking to start selling to a wider audience. I love building totally custom guns based on what the customer asks for, rather than pre-made designs I'm trying to sell. But that thread definitely gives me second thoughts. One bad customer and wham....
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Old 08-27-2019, 02:38 PM   #7
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

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Just read that whole thread. Man what a nightmare. I've been building guns for a few years now, mostly just for friends and local divers, and have been looking to start selling to a wider audience. I love building totally custom guns based on what the customer asks for, rather than pre-made designs I'm trying to sell. But that thread definitely gives me second thoughts. One bad customer and wham....
There is an old saying that you cannot please everybody all of the time, but that should not dissuade you from making and selling guns, especially if you know what you are doing and have a good track record of satisfied customers.
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Old 08-27-2019, 09:18 PM   #8
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

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That is in May 2017, he is still posting in September of that year. "One swallow doth not a Summer make".
Pete-

I never said it was just the one customer, just that the answer(s) are in the thread.

Here's but a few quotes from Jason:

"I'm pretty sure - if i added up all the tools and bits - plus paid myself about 10$ an hour - I will have actually lost money building guns."

"i just saw this thread the other day- since grouper season opened on may 1st - i have been commercial spearing every day. Haven't been back till now...."

"i am officially not taking orders from anyone unless i know you anymore."

Long story short, Jason wasn't earning his living building spearguns, it was a labor of love. And then once it stops being fun anymore... the rest is obvious. Sadly, I think this eventuality is all too common with custom speargun builders. Worse still, Spearboard was a better place when he was contributing. Personally, I never owned or even shot one of his guns, but I did buy some raffle tickets to win one at Blue Wild... which he was generous enough to donate to the event.
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Old 08-28-2019, 06:20 AM   #9
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

I followed the progress of Jason's guns from the first gun to his latest and he had made huge progress. I did interact with him on messages and I can easily see how he would be enthusiastic about building something new and bold. He was always trying to improve and learn and make a better gun. As a Civil Engineer and Architect I many times see how easily an owner can want something while the contractor understands something quite different … this is especially true of something new which has never been built before. It is not always easy for the owner to communicate exactly what he wants or expects and many times those expectations cannot be done within a reasonable budget.

To the gun in question … personally I think it is not practical and obviously there were technical challenges for the build itself. Hopefully both parties have had an amicable resolution and both parties learned from the experience. Would be a shame if Jason stopped building guns as he went through a learning curve that can only be very valuable.
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Old 08-28-2019, 06:31 AM   #10
popgun pete
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

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Originally Posted by AEgir View Post
Pete-

I never said it was just the one customer, just that the answer(s) are in the thread.

Here's but a few quotes from Jason:

"I'm pretty sure - if i added up all the tools and bits - plus paid myself about 10$ an hour - I will have actually lost money building guns."

"i just saw this thread the other day- since grouper season opened on may 1st - i have been commercial spearing every day. Haven't been back till now...."

"i am officially not taking orders from anyone unless i know you anymore."

Long story short, Jason wasn't earning his living building spearguns, it was a labor of love. And then once it stops being fun anymore... the rest is obvious. Sadly, I think this eventuality is all too common with custom speargun builders. Worse still, Spearboard was a better place when he was contributing. Personally, I never owned or even shot one of his guns, but I did buy some raffle tickets to win one at Blue Wild... which he was generous enough to donate to the event.
Well I just took that as his immediate reaction after that rather unfortunate encounter, once it is in your blood it is hard to stop and I figured that he would soon be back to it. If we add up all the time and effort it is never going to be possible to recoup the time and money actually spent on making custom guns unless you go into mass production. It is the achievement that counts and the thought that "I made that" and the earned accolades from the other Masters of Arms who really appreciate what they are looking at.

My view at the time is you settle things privately without turning to forums as there is no point in using public disclosure to try and force an issue. There are details that are not revealed so outsiders are in no position to judge either way and it is not our job to be judge and jury. Personally I think not delivering a 72 inch double with twin lineshafts did the guy a favour as it would likely have dragged him to his doom if he ever stuck a big Tuna with it and was hogtied in the deployed lines wraps. Biggest double I have seen was 60 inch, an “Ultimate” which was heavy as lead.

Last edited by popgun pete; 08-28-2019 at 08:04 AM. Reason: additional comment
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Old 08-28-2019, 09:38 AM   #11
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Ah i see yhe comments now that pretty much answers the questions . Thanks for the input here. Seems like his buddies can get one but not open to the general public any more.

Hope all the best for him. Daryl wong just got himself another order. After reading this. !!!!
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Old 08-28-2019, 03:30 PM   #12
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

I suggest that a sketch always be created and agreed to by the customer so that there is no doubt as to what is to be constructed with notes describing the finer features if they cannot be drawn directly on the sketch. Spearguns are relatively easy to draw up and once signed off that is what the customer gets.

For example here is a double that I drew up decades ago, initially it was going to have two shooting lines until I thought better of it. Drafting programs are way better now, here I used "Paint" which was part of Microsoft Word.
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Old 08-29-2019, 06:41 AM   #13
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Pete,
This sketch made me spit my coffee. It looks like you copied my one off double gun that I made Circa 1995. I will post a picture of that gun here just for kicks. Great minds..... Hahah!!
Cheers,

G.R.

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Originally Posted by popgun pete View Post
I suggest that a sketch always be created and agreed to by the customer so that there is no doubt as to what is to be constructed with notes describing the finer features if they cannot be drawn directly on the sketch. Spearguns are relatively easy to draw up and once signed off that is what the customer gets.

For example here is a double that I drew up decades ago, initially it was going to have two shooting lines until I thought better of it. Drafting programs are way better now, here I used "Paint" which was part of Microsoft Word.
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Old 08-29-2019, 06:51 AM   #14
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

Whats up Red Tide. Thanks for posting here it reminded me to go order those shirts i been bugging you about for the oast 6 months lol....
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:14 AM   #15
popgun pete
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Re: What happened to IMPALER SPEARGUNS

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Originally Posted by Red Tide View Post
Pete,
This sketch made me spit my coffee. It looks like you copied my one off double gun that I made Circa 1995. I will post a picture of that gun here just for kicks. Great minds..... Hahah!!
Cheers,

G.R.
That "Double Trouble", so named because it seemed like it could all go horribly wrong, dates from about 1971-72, and after my Ramset underwater pistols, although I redrew it once I moved onto using a computer many years later. It is actually a redesign of my Groper/Grouper Gun and it was actually going to be used against the big residential reef fish like Cods, but they all got protected by bans on catching them, although the spearfisherman was the main person singled out as line fishermen could still catch (some of) them. With its potential prey gone there was no need to build it and it was not designed for Pelagics, although with different rigging it could have been. It precedes the Ultimate guns, but not some eurogun doubles which were skinny Arbalete gadgets and were never very successful and were mainly produced in the sixties. Double shooting lines and tangles turned most of them into more trouble than they were worth, here I was trying for heavy shafts to knock out big fish, the second shaft carrying a powerhead, either .308 or .222 rimless cartridge rounds which could be ejected out the front, thus no barrels to undo.

Just checking back I mentioned this double gun here: http://www.spearboard.com/showthread...uble%22&page=2, post #17, the drawing was then shown as a pdf file and originally was in a Word file where it had been transferred from a paper based sketch annotated with all the dimensions for its construction. Bar the muzzle guide caps and side wings it was going to be made out of one piece of straight timber, relatively easy to get back then.

I much later suggested a version to Jay using his Metaltech gun with another handle at the back, but that only happened with the later Mach 5 with its rear mounted handle. On these big guns you need two handles to swing them around and to brace for the shot using point and shoot, you don't sight along the barrel. There were three of these designs and one moved the mid-handle to the back so that it was laid out much like my gun, the one shown below is number two.
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Last edited by popgun pete; 08-29-2019 at 05:15 PM. Reason: extra comment on earlier reference
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