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Old 09-12-2014, 11:10 AM   #46
mepps1
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Thanks! It's one of my goals to bring a smile to your face with every post

"truth"....how elusive.
I could post videos and websites that "show" the lunar landing was staged and never happened.

In the end, we believe and support what makes sense to ourselves. The truth is out there Mulder....
Truth isn't so hard. Look for the leader arguing most strenuously for the wholesale murder of his fellow humans. He's almost inevitably the biggest liar. Once you know who the liar is, it's simpler to perceive the truth.

Persuasive and tenacious lying is a basic requirement for all warfare. If men weren't bamboozled, if they knew half the the dirty laundry on their own side, they wouldn't be in such a rush to go kill people on the other side of an imaginary line, let alone on the other side of earth.

Be afraid! Be afraid! They're coming here to get us!

3,000 Americans were murdered on 911, so we need to arrange for 10,000 of our own soldiers to die in foreign wars, killing a few hundred thousand foreign civilians in the process. It's the only possible, righteous, rational response.
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Old 09-12-2014, 03:37 PM   #47
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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3,000 Americans were murdered on 911, so we need to arrange for 10,000 of our own soldiers to die in foreign wars, killing a few hundred thousand foreign civilians in the process. It's the only possible, righteous, rational response.
Do you believe the people that flew our jets into our buildings were done? How do we stop a group of people with the single goal of killing American's because they believe their religion demands it? People that recruit kids and kill their own civilians by the thousands and hide behind women and inside Mosques. Should we just wait here and let them take over half the world simply because it isn't American soil?
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Old 09-12-2014, 03:53 PM   #48
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Truth isn't so hard. Look for the leader arguing most strenuously for the wholesale murder of his fellow humans. He's almost inevitably the biggest liar. Once you know who the liar is, it's simpler to perceive the truth.

Persuasive and tenacious lying is a basic requirement for all warfare. If men weren't bamboozled, if they knew half the the dirty laundry on their own side, they wouldn't be in such a rush to go kill people on the other side of an imaginary line, let alone on the other side of earth.

Be afraid! Be afraid! They're coming here to get us!

3,000 Americans were murdered on 911, so we need to arrange for 10,000 of our own soldiers to die in foreign wars, killing a few hundred thousand foreign civilians in the process. It's the only possible, righteous, rational response.
You're right, they are coming here to get us.
If you think they're not already here you better rethink that position.

I'm sure you and I see things differently.

If you had the power of knowing the future, seeing that pushing the 'red button' and killing 10, 20, 100,000 people in whatever backwater middle eastern country would save 3000 Americans and 10,000 of our soldiers would you push it?
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Old 09-13-2014, 09:36 AM   #49
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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You're right, they are coming here to get us.
If you think they're not already here you better rethink that position.

I'm sure you and I see things differently.

If you had the power of knowing the future, seeing that pushing the 'red button' and killing 10, 20, 100,000 people in whatever backwater middle eastern country would save 3000 Americans and 10,000 of our soldiers would you push it?
Why are "they coming here to get us?" You seem like a (somewhat ) reasonable man. Surely you don't buy the idiot-baiting, small-town-flag-waving-mayor "They hate us for our freedoms" jizzle!

I've seen some social scenes and things for sale in the Caribbean and Mexico that would never be tolerated in the US. So if they really, truly "hated freedom" why not bomb Bimini or Tijuana? Why was New York attacked, and not Montreal?

What if (Wonder of wonders!!!) they hate us because we're over there?
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Old 09-13-2014, 09:42 AM   #50
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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If you had the power of knowing the future, seeing that pushing the 'red button' and killing 10, 20, 100,000 people in whatever backwater middle eastern country would save 3000 Americans and 10,000 of our soldiers would you push it?
Oh, yes sir! The people over there are godless little savages! We should nuc the main bunch and then gas and napalm the survivors, just in case they're dangerous.

Human life only counts when it dresses, smells, talks, and worships like me.

The rest of earth should be squished like the filthy little roaches they are.

There. Have we got on the same moral plane, you and I? I'm glad we could agree on this.
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Old 09-13-2014, 09:48 AM   #51
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Do you believe the people that flew our jets into our buildings were done? How do we stop a group of people with the single goal of killing American's because they believe their religion demands it? People that recruit kids and kill their own civilians by the thousands and hide behind women and inside Mosques. Should we just wait here and let them take over half the world simply because it isn't American soil?
9/11 was clearly a very well-planned event. A carefully orchestrated manipulation. What, precisely where we being manipulated to do? What did it make you want to do?

Que bono?
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Old 09-15-2014, 09:01 AM   #52
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Why are "they coming here to get us?" You seem like a (somewhat ) reasonable man. Surely you don't buy the idiot-baiting, small-town-flag-waving-mayor "They hate us for our freedoms" jizzle!

I've seen some social scenes and things for sale in the Caribbean and Mexico that would never be tolerated in the US. So if they really, truly "hated freedom" why not bomb Bimini or Tijuana? Why was New York attacked, and not Montreal?

What if (Wonder of wonders!!!) they hate us because we're over there?
Thanks, I have my moments being reasonable, depends on if you're asking my wife or kids

They hate us because that's what they've been taught. You're talking about a group of people who are still pissed off about the Crusades a few hundred years ago.
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Old 09-15-2014, 07:03 PM   #53
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Thanks, I have my moments being reasonable, depends on if you're asking my wife or kids

They hate us because that's what they've been taught. You're talking about a group of people who are still pissed off about the Crusades a few hundred years ago.
Is it just a little hypothetically possible that the actions presently occurring remind them in some way of Crusades a few hundred years ago?
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Old 09-15-2014, 08:46 PM   #54
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

Yea. I hear they're like elephants and never forget.
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Old 09-16-2014, 07:55 AM   #55
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Is it just a little hypothetically possible that the actions presently occurring remind them in some way of Crusades a few hundred years ago?
Hypothetically, anything is possible.

I'm just old enough to remember people traveling to Iran, Lebanon etc in the 70's and seeing pics of what those countries looked like. I have friends who grew up there and they said it was beautiful, people were free and happy. What happened
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Old 09-16-2014, 08:14 AM   #56
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Hypothetically, anything is possible.

I'm just old enough to remember people traveling to Iran, Lebanon etc in the 70's and seeing pics of what those countries looked like. I have friends who grew up there and they said it was beautiful, people were free and happy. What happened
This happened;

Amazon.com: Devil's Game: How the United States Helped Unleash Fundamentalist Islam (American Empire Project) (9780805081374): Robert Dreyfuss: Books Amazon.com: Devil's Game: How the United States Helped Unleash Fundamentalist Islam (American Empire Project) (9780805081374): Robert Dreyfuss: Books
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Old 09-16-2014, 10:08 AM   #57
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

Iran is still a beautiful modern socieity. Libya was...the people loved Gaddafi. He was on the way into turning Libya into farmland from desert. Iraq wasn't too bad either. We really have F'd a lot of things up over there...and continue. No wonder they love us.
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Old 09-16-2014, 10:25 AM   #58
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

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Originally Posted by fishfan View Post
Hypothetically, anything is possible.

I'm just old enough to remember people traveling to Iran, Lebanon etc in the 70's and seeing pics of what those countries looked like. I have friends who grew up there and they said it was beautiful, people were free and happy. What happened
I've spent time in Lebanon in the 90's and 2001 and they have been working hard on rebuilding that country. It's a very beautiful place and the people, for the most part, treated me very well.
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Old 07-24-2015, 10:07 PM   #59
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

The Big Hole in the Iran Debate
The Atlantic By Peter Beinart
July 23, 2015 10:43 AM

I have a fantasy. It’s that every politician and pundit who goes on TV to discuss the Iran deal is asked this question first: “Did you support the Iraq War, and how has that experience informed your position?”

For me, it would be a painful question. I supported the Iraq War enthusiastically. I supported it because my formative foreign-policy experiences had been the Gulf War and the wars in Bosnia and Kosovo, all of which led me to exaggerate the efficacy of military force and downplay its risks. As Iraq spiraled into disaster, I felt intellectually unmoored. When my sister-in-law was deployed there for a year, leaving her young daughter behind, I was consumed with guilt that I had contributed to their hardship. To this day, when I walk down the street and see a homeless veteran, I feel nauseous. I give some money and a word of thanks, and think about offering an apology. But I don’t, because there’s no apology big enough. The best I can do is learn from my mistake. These days, that means supporting the diplomatic deal with Iran.

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Why the Iran Deal Makes Obama's Critics So Angry

I’m not saying that everyone who supported the Iraq War must feel as I do. I’m simply saying this: In most televised discussions of Iran, the word “Iraq” never comes up, and that’s insane. The Iraq War was one of the most important, and damaging, episodes in the history of U.S. foreign policy. The debate preceding it pitted people who believed Saddam Hussein was malevolent but rational against people who believed he might well nuke the United States. It pitted people who trusted that International Atomic Energy Agency inspections could contain Saddam’s nuclear program against people who thought he would build a nuke under the IAEA’s nose. Most fundamentally, it pitted people who believed that the only way to keep America safe was to force Iraq’s utter capitulation, via regime change, against people who preferred an imperfect accommodation that did not risk war. Sound familiar?

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Obviously, the circumstances in Iraq and Iran are different. And smart people may offer smart explanations for why the demand for capitulation that proved so disastrous in America’s dealings with Iraq is well-suited to America’s dealings with the country on Iraq’s eastern border. My point is merely this: These people should be required to offer those explanations. If a politician or pundit demanded the deregulation of Wall Street, talk-show hosts would ask why doing so wouldn’t provoke another financial crisis. If a politician or pundit demanded equipping America’s police with military-style equipment, talk-show hosts would ask why doing so wouldn’t provoke another Ferguson.

Yet when it comes to Iran, the debate is almost entirely a la carte. It’s as if there are no relevant precedents (except, perhaps, Munich). Again and again, pundits who championed the invasion of Iraq—people like Bill Kristol and Charles Krauthammer—appear on television advocating the same worldview they advocated in 2002 and 2003, and get to pretend that nothing has happened over the last 15 years to throw that worldview into question. The American Israel Public Affairs Committee, which championed the invasion of Iraq (which is not to suggest, as some have, that AIPAC caused it), can mount a mammoth lobbying campaign against the Iran deal without being asked why, given its track record, anyone should listen to it this time. (Update, July 24: AIPAC spokesman Marshall Wittmann emails to dispute the suggestion that AIPAC lobbied to support the invasion, despite reports to the contrary: “AIPAC never took a position on the Iraq war. To suggest otherwise is a complete falsehood.”) Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, who in 2002 told Congress that “There is no question whatsoever that Saddam is … advancing towards the development of nuclear weapons” and that “If you take out … Saddam’s regime, I guarantee you that it will have enormous positive reverberations on the region,” can appear on Sunday show after Sunday show smugly lecturing the host about the state of Iran’s nuclear program and the Iran deal’s implications for the Middle East without having his earlier comments read back to him.

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If a politician or pundit demanded the deregulation of Wall Street, talk-show hosts would ask why doing so wouldn’t provoke another financial crisis. Yet when it comes to Iran, the debate is almost entirely a la carte.
To a degree that will baffle historians, the political-intellectual complex that made the Iraq War possible remains intact, and powerful. Amnesia is part of the reason why. If Bill Kristol, Charles Krauthammer, and Benjamin Netanyahu knew that before denouncing the Iran deal they’d be required to account for their views on Iraq, they might not show up in the green room. If they did, their television appearances would take a radically different course from the course they generally take today.

The people of Iraq have no choice but to face the war’s consequences: The conflict took half a million Iraqi lives. America’s veterans must face them as well: Almost one-third of those who served in Iraq and Afghanistan have been diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder and nearly 50,000 live, or are close to living, on America’s streets. It’s only fair, therefore, that when people who championed the Iraq War appear in air-conditioned TV studios to debate the Iran deal, they be made to face that war’s consequences too. Were that the norm, I suspect the debate over Iran would barely be a debate at all.

This article was originally published at http://www.theatlantic.com/internati...M_SOURCE=yahoo

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Old 07-25-2015, 11:17 AM   #60
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Re: The Jewish State In A Morally Sick World

Eyep...this Iran deal is the only thing Obama has done that I agree with. It's puzzling to say the least. Obama doesn't seem to like Israel much. I'm surprised that Israel hasn't released some of Obama's past over this.
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