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Diving Safety, Accidents and Incidents Post here to discuss accidents, incidents, ideas, gear, or anything else to improve spearfishing safety. Memorials and condolences threads should be placed in that separate forum.

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Old 02-18-2004, 08:26 PM   #1
Geoff Apthorp
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Exclamation "Near Miss" Bulletins

One of the practices I have seen in both military publications and in the better industrial environments is "Near Miss" bulletins where accidents and near accidents are described - along with recommendations to fix the contributing issues. This type of info sharing is especially beneficial for "mission critical" engagements like flying, operating heavy equipment, handling toxic chemicals etc. The entire aviation community for example, gets to learn from the incident reports. DAN's "Alert Diver" publication prints incident reports - mostly tourists and inexperienced divers. however, We could maintain a forum like this for hunters.

I don't want to dwell on or promote unpleasant topics in Spearboard - but I have learned alot from other divers in the short time I've participated here and I've been diving for over 20 years.

Here's a "near miss" of mine:

Date - Can't remember

Location - Middle grounds
Depth 135'. 2 day trip. This dive was on the morning of the second day. I was tired.

Background: First time spearing AJ's.
Solo , no buddy diver. Drift diving.

Equipment: Steel 80. Biller 60 with reel and kevlar lanyard. Uwatec Alladdin wrist mount computer.

ConditionsSeas less than 2 feet. Good visibility.

Incident Description: Late in the dive, I shot 40 lb class AJ on the bottom. Poor shot placement on the AJ. AJ takes off. In the ensuing fight and entanglement I plowed through the remainder of my gas, ignored the computer alarms while I was doing brain surgery on the AJ. Ended up doing an emergency ascent from 80 feet. Got two breaths off my "empty tank". SOS'd my computer.

No DCS symptoms reaching the surface. Since we were 100 miles offshore, as a preventative measure, I took an 80% mix from my buddies off the boat to 15 foot depth and did an in water standard Navy deco.

Corrective Actions:
1) I always dive with a bailout pony bottle.
2) I free shaft 99% of the time to avoid entanglements. I've lost one shaft in the last 3 years. I'm no dead-eye shot, but I'm not as lazy about shot placement now.
3) If I can't get decent position stalking the fish (to have a resonably good chance of stoning it, or pinning it to the bottom) I wont' take the shot.
4) I prefer buddy diving over solo.
5) I continue to stay in good physical shape. I think the reason I did not embolize or get DCS during this incident was because I was in good physical shape at the time.
6) I read up on in-water recompression and would not do it again.
7) I rarely go to the grounds the night before. I'll sleep at home and get up early so I' not as whipped as driving and sleeping two nights on the water.
8) When I do line shaft an AJ, it's with Kevin's speed load mono which does not tankgel like kevlar line. I try to get to the fish quick and rake it's gills with the knife before doing "brain surgery".

What do you guys think about a forum like this?
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Old 02-18-2004, 08:32 PM   #2
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Sage advice!
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Old 02-18-2004, 10:56 PM   #3
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Excellent idea, and a good post that I learned from thank you.
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Old 02-19-2004, 06:56 AM   #4
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Very good post
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Old 02-19-2004, 09:28 AM   #5
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That's exactly what these safety threads are for.

You're exactly right on avoiding the in water recompression. If you have to surface, and you missed your deco stop, then your best bet is to sit on the boat while breathing that 80% mix.
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Old 02-19-2004, 09:46 AM   #6
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Did you go back into the water to 15' as your post says? Is that really the recommend procedure? As LMRD said and I've been told you're to stay up once up. Any more opinions? Les
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Old 02-19-2004, 10:20 AM   #7
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Great info!
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Old 02-19-2004, 11:12 AM   #8
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Poor Choice

I followed a protocol the Captain had on a plastic slate. Averaged 15-20 feet.

I carry 80% and 100% 0xygen on board my boat now and
I should have stayed topside on 100% O2. My "less than stellar" thinking was that I had less than 2 minutes on the surface prior to grabbing the 80% scrub mix from my buddy. We thought we could prevent a massive bends "hit " even though I had no symptoms in the first 2 minutes on the surface. A compelling reason for the IWR was we were 100 miles offshore where we may or may not have gotten USCG assist had I required it.

Here's agood overview of the limited pros and mostly cons of IWR.

http://www.bishopmuseum.org/research...utz97/iwr.html

Thanks for the feedback. I understand the Safety Topic Area is for postings such as mine above, but I have not read many delineating root causes and corrective actions. However, I still have learned a great deal from the divers on Spearboard.

I did not know Carlson Young but I was deeply saddened to learn of his accident via Spearboard. If our info exchanges here help just one diver then this is a priceless forum.

Last edited by Geoff Apthorp; 02-19-2004 at 04:04 PM.
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Old 02-19-2004, 04:28 PM   #9
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Geoff,
Its a great idea but I will be surprised if you get a lot of people admitting to their major screw ups.
The difference between some of those other forums and publications is the anonymity factor.
Its hard to be a anonymous on this forum.
I hope Im wrong.
It is fun reading about these kinds of storys.
I dont think I will post any of my storys just yet, but lets just say if you do this sport long enough you WILL have some close calls.
The key is never to become complacent no matter how long youve been doing it. It only takes one mistake and it can be all over.
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Old 02-19-2004, 08:08 PM   #10
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Roger That!

Rich - well said! I hope folks will share their experiences. Then everybody benefits.

Geoff
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Old 02-19-2004, 09:37 PM   #11
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As most of you know, I am usally part of the peanut gallery on most of the posts that I jump in on. So it may come as a suprise that this thread has my serious interest.
Geoff, I have been thinking about a thread like this myself. There is an old saying that goes something like this "A wise man learns from his own mistakes, but a truly wise man learns from the mistakes of others"
I too had a near death experience with an A.J.................
I was diving on the Pillsbury with D4B, Bucket One, and Financial Advise a few years ago. I was on the bottom in 110" with a full stringer of grouper and snaper. I looked at my gauges and noticed that I had 600 lbs of air and was close to deco. No brainer, just head up to the surface and life would be good. Well, as I left the wreck I was looking down and noticed a 20 lb grouper floating belly up in the wreck. I went back down from 75" to about 90 feet and grabbed him off the wreck. I then squeezed him on the stringer with the other 20 or so fish and started back for the surface. I checked my gauges and noticed that I now had 400 lbs of air and was ready to flip into deco. I stayed calm controlled my breathing and everything was going great.
At about 50" a school of A.J. s came by. Lucky for them I had a full stringer and not much interest. Well, here comes the 70 plus pounder. He circles me, swims up to me, and looks me in the eye. I look at my gauge and see 400 lbs of air still remain. I say to my self "I can stone this fish"( He is only 2 feet away ) I take perfect aim behind the eye and out the the bottom lip on the otherside. Pull the trigger and bam, I am drugg straight to the bottom so fast my mask almost tears off. Now, I am standing on the sand bottom about 50 feet from the wreck with this Jack kicking my butt. All of the sudden I take a breath and you guessed it, no air........
Now I am in nightmare mode with a 110 feet of water over my head, my heart pounding, and just fliped deco. Fuuuuuuuuuckkkkkkkkkkkk!
I did have enough air in my BC to aid me in my assent to the surface. I paid strict attention to the air in my lungs and released as I was going up.
Now for the luck.......D4B was doing a deco stop at 30 feet, and I was approaching him. However when I got with in 10 feet of him he started for the surface not knowing that I was below him. I screamed at him, and he actually heard me. I gave him the no air signal and he hooked me up. We stayed together while I cleared deco, and we went back to the boat. Needless to say this experience left a mark. Every time I go to the Pillsbury I get creeped out. Every time I stone a Jack I wonder what happend that day. Greed has killed and injured many divers. Don't let it happen to you.
D4B, I still owe you brother.
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Old 02-19-2004, 10:03 PM   #12
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Mr. Apthorpe, Great post! This is exactly the reason why oxygen should always be carried. Much better to have 100% oxygen on the boat than any other option. Glad it worked out as well as it did!
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Old 02-20-2004, 08:05 AM   #13
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Outstanding

Red Tide - Outstanding!

You're right on about learning (alot) from the mistakes of others - I've many times wanted to put one more fish on my stringer in with marginal gas status - your story makes me think twice about that. I bet you remember with great clarity that moment when you were out of air on the bottom wrasslin the AJ. You obviously employed your dive training well. I too was kind of surprised how in the moment I employed my dive training despite the fear factor.

Thank you for postingyour near miss. Red Tide - We must have good karma because we are both truly lucky divers.

Diver Dan - tell us one of your war stories!

Geoff
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Old 02-20-2004, 08:58 AM   #14
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Good Stuff Geoff and Dan. I let a stringer of fish pull me up very quickly in 127' of water. Blew past a safety stop and got on the boat sucking on 80% O2. And all I could think about was getting on an airplane the next morning for a business trip. Scary to say the least. I have learned a lot on this site and it's great to hear people's stories as it will may us all think. What I learned from that episode is disconnect your stringer before making your assent. Now I actually go through a little routine of checking everything before assending. Used to just start up and manuever stringer, gun, computer, and such on my way up. Not anymore. It makes for a more comfortable assent if all you have to worry about is your depth (and critters around you).

PS. Geoff I was not being critical by asking more questions, just making sure I know what "should" be done.
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Old 02-20-2004, 10:51 AM   #15
Geoff Apthorp
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Hey Slay Ride - No problemo - I think it is excellent that everyone is asking questions and challenging each other.

I did not see your questions as being critical or condescending in any way. When it comes to safety, I think everyone should have a "thick skin and broad shoulders". That tip you shared could save someone's life someday.

To answer your question, I think the right procedure regarding IWR is to not do it - Consensus here and in the dive literature seems to be to stay on the surface on 100% O2 under close supervision. I now carry the DAN procedures on board for DCS checks and symptom reminders along with CPROX protocols.

Like you, I think unloading a few things pre-ascent is a great thought because we are multitasking and many times overloading on the way up to the surface. I've tried sending my stringer/catch up on a lift bag and then hang on it for my safety stops.

Multiple benefits to your idea. 1) If anything on the stringer comes back from the dead (and it happens) we don't have to f*** with it on the way up. 2) Won't artifically accelerate the ascent (sometimes I stab the swim bladders and sometimes not). 3) Gets the blood trail and those damn sharp sticker fins away from the diver (nails me through the wetsuit sometimes).
4) Shows the pickup boat where we are early. 5) Makes the safety stops more stable and less work!

Slay Ride - thanks for your inputs. Very valuable and very much appreciated. I am learning alot - hope everyone else is too.

Thanks, Geoff

Last edited by Geoff Apthorp; 02-20-2004 at 10:57 AM.
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