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All About Guns What's your weapon of choice, and why? Discuss the beloved speargun here!

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Old 06-22-2020, 11:59 AM   #1
Gerifalte
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Carbon tuna guns

I wonder if you guys can educate me about the differences between carbon guns to hunt large pelagics like tuna or wahoo.

I am considering two choices: a higher end monocoque gun like the oceanborn 145, https://www.diveshop.gr/index.php/bl...editionle.html, or a non-monocoque option like the Picasso Magnum 140 (switching to an 8mm shaft with slip tip. I have the aluminum version of this gun) https://megasub.com/index.php?route=...roduct_id=1104

The oceanborn is undoubtedly a higher quality piece, but my question is on the performance differences between these two models when hunting large pelagics

Thanks for your insights!
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Old 06-23-2020, 04:52 AM   #2
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by Gerifalte View Post
I wonder if you guys can educate me about the differences between carbon guns to hunt large pelagics like tuna or wahoo.

I am considering two choices: a higher end monocoque gun like the oceanborn 145, https://www.diveshop.gr/index.php/bl...editionle.html, or a non-monocoque option like the Picasso Magnum 140 (switching to an 8mm shaft with slip tip. I have the aluminum version of this gun) https://megasub.com/index.php?route=...roduct_id=1104

The oceanborn is undoubtedly a higher quality piece, but my question is on the performance differences between these two models when hunting large pelagics

Thanks for your insights!
To be 100% sure you will need to shoot both with the same configuration and compare the results.

Telling by the specs I guess the Picasso is going to be much ligther, and therefore a less stable platform to shoot such a heavy shaft. Also, be aware that the shaft might be too heavy for that gun and be tiring on the wrist to move arround, track, etc. It could also kick like a mule.

Mikel
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Old 06-23-2020, 07:04 PM   #3
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by Mikel_24 View Post
To be 100% sure you will need to shoot both with the same configuration and compare the results.

Telling by the specs I guess the Picasso is going to be much ligther, and therefore a less stable platform to shoot such a heavy shaft. Also, be aware that the shaft might be too heavy for that gun and be tiring on the wrist to move arround, track, etc. It could also kick like a mule.

Mikel
thanks for your insights Mikel. I got the aluminum version of that gun (30mm round pipe so it's heavier than your regular aluminum pipegun) with an 8mm shaft and it's amazing how little recoil it has, probably equivalent to my Pathos laser carbon 120. I wanted to upgrade to carbon as that gun is pretty slow to turn in the water and I have missed on a couple big yellows as I couldn't turn it fast enough. But maybe the two carbon options I mentioned are also slow?
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Old 06-24-2020, 06:17 AM   #4
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by Gerifalte View Post
thanks for your insights Mikel. I got the aluminum version of that gun (30mm round pipe so it's heavier than your regular aluminum pipegun) with an 8mm shaft and it's amazing how little recoil it has, probably equivalent to my Pathos laser carbon 120. I wanted to upgrade to carbon as that gun is pretty slow to turn in the water and I have missed on a couple big yellows as I couldn't turn it fast enough. But maybe the two carbon options I mentioned are also slow?
Big guns are never going to track like thin nimble guns, that's a fact.

Now, regarding profiles, and considering that some shapes are more hidrodynamic than others, I think that a flatter-cuttlefish-shaped barrel is going to move arround (sideways) much better than a round or square barrel.

Think Abellan profile for example.

Also keep in mind that with long guns you usually keep it tucked to your body, use one hand on the handle and the other one in the middle of the gun to turn/rotate it and then extend your hand to do the final aim and shot.

It is not like you are trying to track the fish with the arm extended using only your hand holding wrist.

With this in mind, I guess the Oceanborn is a better choice.

Mikel
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Old 06-24-2020, 09:33 AM   #5
2fishin2
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

Unless the OB trigger mech got replaced by a higher quality, properly functioning one, I would recommend do not purchase one. Much better big fish guns out there cheaper than it anyways.
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Old 06-24-2020, 03:23 PM   #6
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by Mikel_24 View Post
Big guns are never going to track like thin nimble guns, that's a fact.

Now, regarding profiles, and considering that some shapes are more hidrodynamic than others, I think that a flatter-cuttlefish-shaped barrel is going to move arround (sideways) much better than a round or square barrel.

Think Abellan profile for example.

Also keep in mind that with long guns you usually keep it tucked to your body, use one hand on the handle and the other one in the middle of the gun to turn/rotate it and then extend your hand to do the final aim and shot.

It is not like you are trying to track the fish with the arm extended using only your hand holding wrist.

With this in mind, I guess the Oceanborn is a better choice.

Mikel

Awesome, very good points Mikel! I do use both hands as you describe to track the big pipe gun, but not always keep it close enough to my body.

Do you think effective shooting range is much different between the two?
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Old 06-24-2020, 03:27 PM   #7
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Unless the OB trigger mech got replaced by a higher quality, properly functioning one, I would recommend do not purchase one. Much better big fish guns out there cheaper than it anyways.
I hear you, I have heard first hand bad stories about the old mech in the OB. I believe they fixed the mech now.

Great that you know of better, cheaper options! What other carbon guns would you recommend? Not considering wood at this point.
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Old 06-24-2020, 03:53 PM   #8
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

http://www.trygons.com/fishing/spearguns
Not sure about the reel, but looks a substantial gun.
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Old 06-24-2020, 04:00 PM   #9
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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http://www.trygons.com/fishing/spearguns
Not sure about the reel, but looks a substantial gun.
I have seen those beasts, do you know much about them? I am interested in how they track compared to a pipe gun, and effective shooting range.
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Old 06-24-2020, 04:13 PM   #10
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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I have seen those beasts, do you know much about them? I am interested in how they track compared to a pipe gun, and effective shooting range.
I remember them being talked about years ago and the name popped up in my memory just now while reading this thread, so I checked it out. Cross-sectional area and its shape from the hydrodynamic aspects affects the lateral drag, the flattened or cuttle bone shapes provide some improvement, but bands still add to drag sitting on top of the gun. Plenty of bands to propel a knock out hit shaft cannot be mounted on a wand, so drag is unavoidable. Manoeuvring for an intercept shot is preferable to hauling the gun around as turning the entire gun body from the rear you can rarely follow the fish unless he is further out.

Moving the bulk of the gun closer to the handle improves the gun's turning which is what C4 and others have done. You cannot do that with a pipe gun.
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Old 06-24-2020, 04:21 PM   #11
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

Briante have a new model. https://www.briantespeargun.com/en/p...s/b3-vastator/

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Old 06-24-2020, 08:36 PM   #12
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by popgun pete View Post
I remember them being talked about years ago and the name popped up in my memory just now while reading this thread, so I checked it out. Cross-sectional area and its shape from the hydrodynamic aspects affects the lateral drag, the flattened or cuttle bone shapes provide some improvement, but bands still add to drag sitting on top of the gun. Plenty of bands to propel a knock out hit shaft cannot be mounted on a wand, so drag is unavoidable. Manoeuvring for an intercept shot is preferable to hauling the gun around as turning the entire gun body from the rear you can rarely follow the fish unless he is further out.

Moving the bulk of the gun closer to the handle improves the gun's turning which is what C4 and others have done. You cannot do that with a pipe gun.

Good insights, thanks a lot!
That briante also looks great, I'll look into it. I suspect it's pretty expensive lol
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Old 06-25-2020, 01:35 AM   #13
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by Gerifalte View Post
I hear you, I have heard first hand bad stories about the old mech in the OB. I believe they fixed the mech now.

Great that you know of better, cheaper options! What other carbon guns would you recommend? Not considering wood at this point.
Actually I was talking about wood gun about being cheaper option, sorry.

Trygone spearguns are HUGE beasts of a gun. I dont understand how a person could handle such a gun.

You are going to find that railgun shape handle better than any other gun. I've learned the hard way (money spent) that these cuddlefish shapes are nothing but hype and handle terribly especially in current.

Any railgun you can put 3 bands on and shoot an 8mm shaft will work for your needs.
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Old 06-25-2020, 06:37 AM   #14
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

You and the gun are moving in the current as well as the fish, so motions are relative. If you turn into a current or are hanging onto something then current will have an effect on you and the gun. Same as with surge down near the bottom, everything swings back and forth, but so do the fish in the immediate vicinity.
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Old 06-25-2020, 11:10 AM   #15
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Re: Carbon tuna guns

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Originally Posted by 2fishin2 View Post

You are going to find that railgun shape handle better than any other gun. I've learned the hard way (money spent) that these cuddlefish shapes are nothing but hype and handle terribly especially in current.

Any railgun you can put 3 bands on and shoot an 8mm shaft will work for your needs.
thanks, essentially you're agreeing with my wife's argument: keep your current gun. The one I am trying to replace is a Picasso Tuna, interesting model they discontinued last year. Has a 30mm pipe so it's heavier, 8mm shaft with slip tip, and 3 14mm bands. Zero recoil but doesn't turn easily. Then again, as you said it might turn better than the carbon ones.
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