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All About Guns What's your weapon of choice, and why? Discuss the beloved speargun here!

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Old 03-24-2018, 06:02 PM   #16
kavachi
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Re: Abellan Denton 120_2017 Test

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Originally Posted by brandon cadalzo View Post
I’m just wondering if a 7.5mm x 160 shaft could pass through a tuna with the same or better performance than a 8mm shaft given the same range in spearq8’s video. I do like how the 7.5 shaft offers a much flatter trajectory towards the end of 2 wraps. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Havent managed to get hold of the foam to match Majd's properly quantifiable penetration testing, but have experimented with a bunch of different shaft/stock/band combinations in reef, open water, bluewater [even taking single band pipegun chasing hoo and seriolas, just to see how it goes] and target shooting in the lagoon. Keep coming back to the same three combinations that fit their respective uses so well.

7mm x 140cm Hunt single flopper shaft on 125cm bandstretch optimised pipegun [very sim to 110 Pathos], single 15mm band @ 380%, Meandros mech, single wrap 2mm LP mono for durability. this is daily driver for shooting around the reef, super quick to load, very streamlined and easy to swing, plenty of penetration in that 3 to 4 metre range but not so much you’re digging shafts out of the coral. tried 6.75mm and 6.5mm shafts on this rig, looking to lighten up even more, but wasn’t happy with penetration. Looking forward to putting dbl roll mech in this gun.

7.5mm x 160cm Hunt single flopper shaft on 135cm bandstretch wood gun [optimised version of 120 Denton], twin 14.5mm bands at 380%, Ermes dbl roll Long mech, single wrap 2mm LP mono. The ultimate do it all gun. manoeuvrable enough for swinging on schooling fish and pinging trout in the coral, but goes thru thick fish at 4.5 metres range. for open water work sub in double flopper version of shaft [muzzle track recessed to accept extra top flopper] and double wrap breakaway - sweet setup for hoo and mahi

8.5mm x 170cm Hunt double flopper shaft on 145cm bandstretch wood gun [optimised version of 130 Albacore], triple 15mm bands at 380%. Ermes dbl roll Long mech, three wraps of 400lb coated cable breakaway. for bigger dogs, YFT, and marlin. even with the cable shoots flat to target at 8 metres. definitely not for reef work unless you enjoy excavating shafts

all these shafts have the ultra durable Hunt flopper/s with welded cone, and have 3cm chopped off the tail to get the rear tab snug with the mech. the wood guns are heavier and little fatter than Abellans as built from 0.8 s.g. Vitex wood

curious as to how 9.5mm x 170 double flopper shaft would go with the three hot 15mm bands [maybe even try 16mm small ID bands, extend loading pad a couple of cm to ease loading?] as even more punch would boost confidence on longer shots on big dogs and YFT, without hassle of loading four bands but need the time to build a fatter stock to float that shaft and soak up additional recoil…..and find the $$$ for another pair of big Hunt shafts!

big, big THANKS!!!!! to Majd for his testing and development

Last edited by kavachi; 03-24-2018 at 06:22 PM.
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Old 03-26-2018, 05:13 AM   #17
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Re: Abellan Denton 120_2017 Test

Quote:
Originally Posted by brandon cadalzo View Post
I’m just wondering if a 7.5mm x 160 shaft could pass through a tuna with the same or better performance than a 8mm shaft given the same range in spearq8’s video. I do like how the 7.5 shaft offers a much flatter trajectory towards the end of 2 wraps.


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Yes it did! Also shots were much flatter ... I remember after the test thinking that the best setup for that gun would be a 7.5mm shaft. That doesn't mean that 8mm shaft won't do well, just that a 7.5mm felt like it had better performance with 2 bands.

The gun in this test was sent to Mario from Ermessub. He lost his gun in some confusion as he was landing a fish. I guess the current carried the gun away when he thought his dive buddy had it. So I sent him this one as I have way too many guns that I am not using. He changed the muzzle slightly and put 3 bands on it and is using an 8mm shaft. He is extremely happy with results and sent me video of him nailing some really difficult long range shots on large wary snapper ... one after the other. With 3 bands you can probably flatten the trajectory on an 8mm shaft, but then recoil needs to be in check. If you mod the handle recoil is not an issue ... so 3 bands will give that 8mm shaft that little bit of extra performance to keep the shaft flat. If you look at my Albacore 120 video you can see performance of 8mm shaft with 3 bands. That gun used to be called a Denton 130 but is now an Albacore 120. The Albacore 120 has a little more mass than the gun tested here and identical band stretch, but with a modded handle the performance should be the same. The second video is where I forgot to put the penetration testing on the first video for 8mm shaft.


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Old 03-26-2018, 05:20 AM   #18
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Re: Abellan Denton 120_2017 Test

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Originally Posted by kavachi View Post


Havent managed to get hold of the foam to match Majd's properly quantifiable penetration testing, but have experimented with a bunch of different shaft/stock/band combinations in reef, open water, bluewater [even taking single band pipegun chasing hoo and seriolas, just to see how it goes] and target shooting in the lagoon. Keep coming back to the same three combinations that fit their respective uses so well.

7mm x 140cm Hunt single flopper shaft on 125cm bandstretch optimised pipegun [very sim to 110 Pathos], single 15mm band @ 380%, Meandros mech, single wrap 2mm LP mono for durability. this is daily driver for shooting around the reef, super quick to load, very streamlined and easy to swing, plenty of penetration in that 3 to 4 metre range but not so much you’re digging shafts out of the coral. tried 6.75mm and 6.5mm shafts on this rig, looking to lighten up even more, but wasn’t happy with penetration. Looking forward to putting dbl roll mech in this gun.

7.5mm x 160cm Hunt single flopper shaft on 135cm bandstretch wood gun [optimised version of 120 Denton], twin 14.5mm bands at 380%, Ermes dbl roll Long mech, single wrap 2mm LP mono. The ultimate do it all gun. manoeuvrable enough for swinging on schooling fish and pinging trout in the coral, but goes thru thick fish at 4.5 metres range. for open water work sub in double flopper version of shaft [muzzle track recessed to accept extra top flopper] and double wrap breakaway - sweet setup for hoo and mahi

8.5mm x 170cm Hunt double flopper shaft on 145cm bandstretch wood gun [optimised version of 130 Albacore], triple 15mm bands at 380%. Ermes dbl roll Long mech, three wraps of 400lb coated cable breakaway. for bigger dogs, YFT, and marlin. even with the cable shoots flat to target at 8 metres. definitely not for reef work unless you enjoy excavating shafts

all these shafts have the ultra durable Hunt flopper/s with welded cone, and have 3cm chopped off the tail to get the rear tab snug with the mech. the wood guns are heavier and little fatter than Abellans as built from 0.8 s.g. Vitex wood

curious as to how 9.5mm x 170 double flopper shaft would go with the three hot 15mm bands [maybe even try 16mm small ID bands, extend loading pad a couple of cm to ease loading?] as even more punch would boost confidence on longer shots on big dogs and YFT, without hassle of loading four bands but need the time to build a fatter stock to float that shaft and soak up additional recoil…..and find the $$$ for another pair of big Hunt shafts!

big, big THANKS!!!!! to Majd for his testing and development
I agree with everything here. I am not sure what it would take for a 9.5mm shaft ... but would be an interesting try. I have a 9mm shaft but really haven't put it through its paces. An 8.5mm shaft really has a lot of performance and I would probably prefer to just push the bands to 390% or 400%. This setup is very quick to load and extremely powerful ... you can aim at the top part of an orange at 1 meter and keep that aim and move the orange to 8 meters and still be able to hit it using the same aim point. That is really helpful in clear open water where distances are hard to gauge.
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Old 08-23-2021, 05:03 PM   #19
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Re: Abellan Denton 120_2017 Test

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Yes this is now called the Denton 120 ... with 132cm band stretch. I think the perfect shaft for this length of gun would be a 155cm shaft. I just feel there is too much wasted shaft overhang. Of course I would prefer a 5cm or 6cm longer gun as that would come in handy with the heavier 8mm shafts. If you look at the Pathos Sniper 125 ... that gun actually needs a 165cm shaft as some floppers would sit on the track. Of course I don't let the flopper sit on the track and will let it hang ... but a 160cm shaft is slightly too short for that gun ... yet it is too long IMHO for the Denton 120.

Is there any disadvantages to letting the flopper sit on the muzzle? I have an 8mm x 150cm shaft that looks beautiful on the gun. The flopper sits right on the recess on the muzzleClick image for larger version

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Old 08-24-2021, 05:10 AM   #20
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Re: Abellan Denton 120_2017 Test

If the flopper is not lifting the shaft over the track then it is no problem at all. Actually I prefer this setup, especially with lighter shafts as it allows you to keep shaft length to a minimum and thus you have maximum power for a given footprint. What you really need to avoid is the shaft being lifted up by the flopper ... also you need to keep an eye on line over shaft ... and make sure the shaft is not being "bent" down when you pass line over shaft. If that happens the shaft will spring up and jump off the track a little when you shoot. This causes destabilization and drop in accuracy. You can test that by laying the shaft on track and pushing down where the line goes over when you load. It should not bend down even a little and when you release it should not jump up. If it does then you need to put 3 layers of electric tape on a super straight shaft and lay a mix of epoxy and strong filler in a 1 inch strip where the line goes over the shaft. This will bring the shaft to a perfect height on track. Don't worry if this elevates the shaft above the track a little as this has no effect on accuracy(unless the gap is very big).
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